Bridge collapse in Baltimore

[RickeyM]

Time from lights-out to lights-on was less than 60 seconds. Not bad.

Thing is, we have no idea what was going on in the engine room before the lights went out, or after they came back on.

Lights out, they probably lost steerage, but the main engines should have still been on line.

Granted, I'm used to US standards for construction and safety, which are/were pretty good IMHO. Foreign Flag vessels other than the GB, the EU, etc. have some pretty sketchy operations.

Ship was registered in Singapore but could have had an engineering crew that didn't even speak the same language as the deck officers. Crazy, yes, but they allow it.

FWIW - Speaking as a retired Ships Engineer and Merchant Marine Academy graduate.

There was a plume of smoke that the theory so far was the ship being put into full reverse.

 

[Blue Shadow]

Looking at the video, it appears the ship changes direction after the power was restored. Prior to that it seems the ship might have missed the bridge support. Don't know the black box information but there is that distinct change in direction after the lights came back on.

The video is not revealing enough but in conjunction with the map plot of course it shows what happened.

I know this think is like a mile long freight train, it is not going to stop and it is gonna be hell to get it to turn. But the investigation will reveal what was going on.

 

[Ross6860]

Impossible to say at this stage.

Impossible to say with certainty, but highly likely.

If they have any design standards at all, the main engines will typically continue to operate and respond to helm commands without the need for electricity until they run out of compressed air. This can take quite a while (several minutes or much longer). It all depends on how it was built, and maintained.

Heavy black smoke could be from running max fuel at a low engine RPM in an attempt to stop the ship.

I had heard (not verified) it was a single screw ship, so running hard astern at 7 knots will cause the ship to turn due to the prop torque.

A helicopter also reported at least one anchor was deployed, also in an attempt to stop the ship.

 

[gadget73]

Based on the back end of the ship swinging around when the black smoke starts to roll I'm also thinking they hit full reverse in an attempt to slow down. It pinwheeled the back of the thing around but it didn't check the forward motion enough to prevent the impact. Looks like what you'd get from a single screw. It will walk sideways rather than just going straight back.

 

[Ross6860]

Based on the back end of the ship swinging around when the black smoke starts to roll I'm also thinking they hit full reverse in an attempt to slow down. It pinwheeled the back of the thing around but it didn't check the forward motion enough to prevent the impact. Looks like what you'd get from a single screw. It will walk sideways rather than just going straight back.

It was reported the ship was single-screw.

 

[KingBubba]

There has been some discrepancy between when the bridge was built. It is reported to have been built in 1977. The Governor of Maryland reported having crossed it as a child. He looks older than being a child in 1977. Who knows what kind things we will find out with this disaster.

 

[motorstereo]

It was reported the ship was single-screw.

Is that a bad thing? Would a twin screw have been better in that situation?

 

[Mumbles]

Would a twin screw have been better in that situation?

Twin screws with counter rotating propellers would exert an even propulsion force on the ship but a single prop will tend to walk the stern sideways in either forward or reverse. This is due to the water being lighter or less dense at the top of the propeller next to the surface. Air can also enter the prop at the surface causing ventilation while the blades at the bottom of the prop will have more bite in the water. Depending on the direction of rotation, the stern will tend to move in the opposite direction of the lower blades.

This force comes in handy while docking a boat with a single prop as it can be used to swing the stern over in the desired direction. Trim tabs on an outboard or sterndrive are adjusted to counteract this force at cruising speeds as the boat will want to pull to one side.

 

[GChief]

Is that a bad thing? Would a twin screw have been better in that situation?

Twin screws typically counter rotate so it would basically continue on the same heading.

 

[gadget73]

Exactly all this. If you watch the video, when the power comes back and the smoke starts you can see the stern walking sideways towards the other bridge tower before the power quits the second time. Thats the prop walk pulling it over.

 

[RickeyM]

A video with a longer lead in. It shows the Dali going through cycles of losing power then getting it back. There just wasn't enough time to recover and change the ship's path. I saw somewhere that they even dropped anchor. Even if that's the case, that's still a whole lotta' ship to stop.

 

[RickeyM]

B

This is what you call a lucky escape. Two cars perched on the precipice of Hobart's Tasman Bridge after the container ship, SS Lake Illawarra crashed into the bridge in 1975 killing 12 people.

Boy that'll make the ol' anal sphincter clench.

 

[WillVT]

I wonder if there was any current involved.
I also just read that even before it lost power, it was too far to the side, and not lined up to the center of the bridge like it should have been.

 

[gadget73]

I had read that they called in a loss of control just after leaving the port, so that may be part of it. I'm sure the investigation will figure out who to blame for this, aka who is going to pay for it all.

 

[GChief]

Was talking to a good friend last night over some beers about this. He is a Pilot here in the south part of the Bay, Norfolk, Portsmouth ect.

"all these armchair Capts, Pilots and Civil engineers need to wait for the investigation to play out"

The 2022 bridge collapse in P-Burg just had the report released last week (I think). This will probably take just as long.

Waiting for the next shiny object to come along

 

[Ross6860]

Current, wind... The sides of that ship are like sails.

Was talking to a good friend last night over some beers about this. He is a Pilot here in the south part of the Bay, Norfolk, Portsmouth ect.

"all these armchair Capts, Pilots and Civil engineers need to wait for the investigation to play out"

The 2022 bridge collapse in P-Burg just had the report released last week (I think). This will probably take just as long.

Waiting for the next shiny object to come along

Exactly!

The crew needs to be interviewed. Who knows what was going on in the engine room and the pilot house.

They could have been having a bunch of issues.

Now I hear they got a load of bad fuel? Could have caused a problem, but typically that fuel is centrifuged and treated before going to a "day tank". Fuel for the main engines and generators then flows from the day tank to the units. The individual engines then have additional filtration. Guess they could have screwed up the maintenance on the centrifuge (we cleaned ours every 12-24 hours).

 

[kirk57]

"all these armchair Capts, Pilots and Civil engineers need to wait for the investigation to play out"

yep.

Can we just assume for the moment that all involved did the best they could to avoid this?

 

[Shominy]

I don't know if it's normal, but the ship took a circuitous route out from Seagirt.

 

[Shominy]

yep.

Can we just assume for the moment that all involved did the best they could to avoid this?

Yes, it really does seem so.

 

[GChief]

fuel is centrifuged and treated before going to a "day tank".

I just did a ship check for a new upgrade that gets rid of those on one of the USS classes. Both FO and LO, lets to much crap through.

yep.

Can we just assume for the moment that all involved did the best they could to avoid this?

As an OOD UW I have been in a few butthole puckering situations, its not fun and you do the best you can making decisions!